The Group Dentistry Now Show: The Voice Of The DSO Industry

Jon Fidler, CEO of Fidler & Associates discusses DSO and dental group practice executive recruitment with Bill Neumann of Group Dentistry Now. Jon explains what positions are hot right now, provides advice for DSOs looking to hire, advice for job seekers, what to expect during the hiring process and what the current state of executive search is in the DSO industry. If you are looking to fill an executive role or searching for a career with a DSO or emerging dental group then this podcast is for you!

Career seekers and DSOs looking for guidance from Jon can email here – jfidler@fidlerandassociates.com.

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Our podcast series brings you dental support and emerging dental group practice analysis, conversation, trends, news and events. Listen to leaders in the DSO and emerging dental group space talk about their challenges, successes, and the future of group dentistry. The Group Dentistry Now Show: The Voice of the DSO Industry has listeners across North & South America, Australia, Europe, and Asia. If you like our show, tell a friend or a colleague.

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Full Transcript:

Bill Neumann:

I’d like to welcome everyone to the Group Dentistry Now show. I am Bill Neumann and happy to have, first off, everybody listening in today. Without you, we wouldn’t have a show and of course, without great guests, you wouldn’t be continually coming back to listen in or watch us.

Bill Neumann:

Today, we have a great guest as usual, Jon Fidler and Jon is the president, CEO, and I believe he’s also the founder of Fidler and Associates. They’re an executive search firm specifically in the DSO industry. So Jon, welcome to the Group Dentistry Now show.

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, thank you for having me. Excited to be on.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah. And so I had the pleasure of seeing Jon in person last week. I know, in person’s kind of a strange thing to say, well, finally getting back at it. And so Jon and I were one or two of the 1300 plus people at the Dykema DSO conference in Denver. So it was great to see you, Jon.

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, likewise, it was refreshing to get to meet folks in person and kind of get back on the circuit a little bit and see everybody and just kind of have that personal touch and the energy there. So it was great.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah. So maybe we’ll talk a little bit about the event first and then I’ll give you a little bit of it. Well, first off, let me do this, give you a little bit of background on Jon. Like I mentioned, the CEO of Fidler and associates. Jon actually has a really interesting background.

Bill Neumann:

He actually started honing his talent recognition skills as he worked for the Arizona Diamondbacks. That’s major league baseball for the folks that don’t know. In the scouting and player development departments. In his role, Jon was responsible for not only recognizing the physical talent of potential prospects, but also developing that talent into a championship caliber team .

Bill Neumann:

Jon, beyond being involved with the Arizona Diamondbacks. Let’s talk a little bit about your dental experience before you started your own organization, Fidler and associates.

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. So kind of everything just kind of blends together when you’re going through things, with your previous careers and kind of getting established in the professional world. You never know where it’s going to lead to, but with the Diamondbacks, it was just kind of evaluating talent, both physically and kind of putting the team together.

Jon Fidler:

And then that kind of led to a smooth transition, I would like to say, into the dental world. So the travel and everything, had to start contributing to the family and making some money. So got into the dental world and worked with Patterson for about 10 years and was fortunate enough to experience that and the culture there that Patterson had built.

Jon Fidler:

And was a territory rep for about five years. And then I always say I got demoted to branch manager in Austin where it was more headaches and less pay. But I really loved it over here and enjoyed meeting … or kind of getting more involved on the management side and kind of back to putting teams together and putting folks in the right spots and guiding and mentoring them.

Jon Fidler:

And just found myself really in the middle of kind of the hub of the dental industry here in central Texas and really kind of connecting folks with opportunities, whether our manufacturers were looking or we were looking or whatever it was. And so ended up kind of just really falling in love with that part of the job, which was really not part of the job description. And I felt like, “Hey, I might be able to monetize this,” and decided to branch out and start Fidler and Associates and been very blessed with it so far. So here we are.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah, that’s excellent. And I mean, I remember meeting you at one of the events. Actually, I think it was an event in Austin. I don’t know if it was DDSO or it might’ve been Heidi’s hygiene event. They were both kind of back to back in Austin, but we met at a Courtyard Marriott to just kind of talk about what was going on at the industry at the time.

Bill Neumann:

Now, of course-

Jon Fidler:

Where the business gets done, at Courtyards. Yes.

Bill Neumann:

Things have certainly changed quite a bit as far as the acceleration of the consolidation in the dental industry. And certainly you were involved from the beginning, so of … first off, tell me your thoughts on the Dykema meeting we just mentioned earlier at the lead in that we were both there. What’d you think of the meeting?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, no, I thought … so Brian and his team do an excellent job every year. And I always feel like that’s the one meeting that we look forward to. I think obviously with just the sheer size of everything was great and the amount of folks that were there and just kind of a refresher to get back into that, kind of the show shape, I call it. Where we’re sitting there and meeting people and talking to folks and kind of just the energy of everything.

Jon Fidler:

And so, those types of meetings, I think, are good for the industry where folks are together and able to kind of just refresh, especially after COVID. I think everybody had some pent up energy and probably getting a little bit, you feel a little bit socially out on an island when you’re just kind of working from home or remotely and not being able to see folks.

Jon Fidler:

So I thought overall it was great and really enjoyed the time. And from our standpoint, selfishly, we got to meet a lot of folks. Through COVID, it’s been a lot of zoom calls and phone calls. And so getting to meet some of the folks we’ve placed in person and worked with was just awesome.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah, it was kind of my takeaway as well. Always a great event. It’s getting huge. I think they definitely topped the event that they did back in 2019 in Dallas, for sure. And kind of to your point, it was interesting seeing people for the first time, ever in some cases, in person that your relationship was based on emails and zoom.

Bill Neumann:

So it was very refreshing and you know, it kind of leads into this first question, Jon. As far as COVID, talk a little bit about … first off, why don’t you talk a little bit about what Fidler and Associates does and then I’d love to ask what you were doing during COVID.

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, so I think probably the easiest way is we’re an executive search firm, focused solely within the dental and DSO world. And we don’t really do any staffing or doctor recruitment. That’s not really our kind of strength. And so typically what we do is we focus more on the business and executive side.

Jon Fidler:

So regional manager up through C level, we work with groups anywhere from 2, 3, 4 locations, as they’re just getting started and kind of structuring their executive team, all the way up to the large groups that have multiple hundreds of locations and help them out with their searches as well.

Jon Fidler:

So that’s kind of where our focus has been. And we also do work with some of the ancillary services that kind of come into the dental and DSO market with brokerage companies, consulting groups, IT groups. So we just feel we have a pretty good network within the dental world. And hopefully that puts a little bit of perspective on it.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah. You sure do. So talk about COVID and executive search during that time.

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. So it definitely changed kind of the process. The people part of the business, we just feel is like the heartbeat of everything, whether it’s a DSO or a manufacturer or distributor or a technology firm, whatever it ends up being. But if you have the right folks in place, then it makes just the company a lot more progressive and easier and profitable and just, really, you name it.

Jon Fidler:

It just helps out when you have a good people, and so typically I think through COVID everybody had to adapt. We were not excluded from that. And so, I think it limited the amount of in-person interviews and those types of things. Obviously, just with the safety precautions and any rules and laws and regulations that were put in place about travel, those types of things.

Jon Fidler:

And I think just from a personal standpoint, too, it limited some of those things, but you know, it really ramped up, I think, on this thing thankful for zoom. I think everybody’s probably zoomed out at this point throughout, but we just kind of adapted that way, maybe a few extra phone calls, a few extra zooms.

Jon Fidler:

And then ultimately, it does come down to meeting. And so it just may have limited a little bit that way, but was definitely a market that we weren’t sure what was going to happen through COVID, with everybody kind of shutting down those first six to eight weeks and trying to let the dust settle to see where it was happening.

Jon Fidler:

But things ramped back up pretty quickly. I think it was a bit with a lot of offices and groups, and we were fortunate enough to stay busy during that time. But I think just really the adaptation from our end came through the processes of interviewing through technology.

Bill Neumann:

So let’s talk a little bit about … people couldn’t meet in person, the candidate couldn’t meet the group that they might be working for or ended up working for in person and vice versa. Right?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah.

Bill Neumann:

So, I mean, I’m sure that presented some challenges. What do things look like now? I mean, I’m not going to say we’re out of COVID because we’re not.

Jon Fidler:

Sure.

Bill Neumann:

But things have opened back up. Has recruiting kind of come back where it’s more final interview in person type stuff, or is it still, are there still hires that are being done totally virtually?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, so I would say the in-person, we always kind of felt like that’s kind of where the secret sauce is at. And so really, instead of having maybe a couple of interviews in person, just obviously, depending on geography and where folks are located and where the candidates are coming from. But typically we’d have two or three kinds of in-person meetings where they’d meet with the hiring manager, then with kind of the executive team or the board, and kind of go through that process.

Jon Fidler:

So I think with COVID, it probably limited that down to one, kind of final interview. They would maybe do those initial one or two with the team via zoom. But yeah, I think now that we’ve kind of crossed that threshold, folks are in kind of … I guess none of us know exactly what curve ball’s coming next, but it’s definitely kind of ran back up. Like with the show, we had some interviews happen out at the show.

Jon Fidler:

And so it just kind of helps to get back kind of that personal feeling and maybe add in that in-person, for not just the hiring manager, just the final interview that you get to meet a little bit of the team, you get to understand a little bit more of the culture and talk to folks live, that are just part of the group. And really just kind of ensure everything is what you see or pick up on through the technology or phone calls and zoom meetings.

Jon Fidler:

So I think it definitely helps out that we’re kind of on this, hopefully the backside of everything and kind of get back to normal a little bit, but I do think just kind of with the adaptation and meeting in person we’re a little bit back more to the normal process.

Bill Neumann:

Talk to me a little bit about what’s the current state of executive search specifically within the group practice and the DSO industry. What are you seeing?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, so I think kind of with everything with COVID, we kind of saw two different paths. We saw the smaller groups maybe that were struggling and maybe kind of ramped up their acquisition or being purchased by, or partnering with larger groups. And so there was some movement that way, which can be a good and bad thing, depending on which side you’re on, I guess.

Jon Fidler:

But it definitely opened up some really good candidates and positions with these larger groups that are expanding for more opportunities. So we were able to shuffle around a few folks that way. And then there’s also those groups that maybe were initially doing well. They’ve been good stewards of finances and business. And I don’t think anybody’s really prepared for COVID, but we’re able to kind of adapt to it and survive that.

Jon Fidler:

And it probably puts them in a little bit more leveraged position now that the groups are coming after them and they’ve kind of gone through it. So those executives are a little bit more steadfast and seeing things through. And maybe not as quick to jump. And kind of look around where they feel like, “Hey, we’re with a really good group.”

Jon Fidler:

And it’s kind of resonated with them that they can make it through and the group’s in good standing and they provided good leadership. So we definitely saw a lot of movement from one side and then kind of a little bit of digging in from the other, which is, I think, a great sign for everybody.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah. I mean, that sounds great. Are you seeing, currently, more positions, are there certain positions that seem to be more in demand?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. We go through spurts. And so, I think everybody tries to differentiate themselves a little bit as they kind of progress and grow and scale and have different needs evolve throughout, as these groups grow. So one thing that we’re definitely seeing a push on right now is business development folks.

Jon Fidler:

And I think that’s just out of the fact that the market is out there. The larger groups or private equity groups are out looking to bring folks on. They have the finances to do that and the backing to do that. And so the business development role has been really kind of a hot spot for us lately.

Jon Fidler:

And then the other side of that too, is within the practices or within the headquarters is kind of the revenue cycle and financial side. So we’ve seen a lot of financial positions listed that way, where things can kind of tighten up, now that they’re kind of on this backside and they’ve kind of seen where they can tighten things up and maybe it’s not so much in the production side of growth, but maybe they can improve their EBITDA by some different things financially that they can do. So I’d say those are the two things that have kind of been more of an emphasis here through COVID.

Bill Neumann:

So business development and rev cycle or financially?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. And the financial side where they have some room. Yep, yep.

Bill Neumann:

Yep. So, interesting here and correct me if I’m wrong, biz development, I’ve seen a lot of people transition over from the distribution or manufacturing side of the dental industry and be successful in a business development role at a DSO. Have you seen that as well?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, so there’s definitely a lot more interest from that side. So we typically … candidates, if they’re looking, will either reach out to us or if we talk to a group and they’re open to maybe doing something a little bit different, I think that goes back to kind of the differentiating yourself a little bit.

Jon Fidler:

We always feel like there’s just people out there that get it. You can plug them in from a manufacturer to a group side and they understand the process and perspective of the role and what they’re required to do. And maybe have enough insight that the ramp up period is shortened a little bit. But yeah, it’s, I think, a way to differentiate, maybe approach things a little bit differently, maybe bring a little bit different Rolodex or contact list into those sides.

Jon Fidler:

You know, I was joking. I think I’ve probably joked with you before. I call it dental Mayberry. It’s just a small world. And you know, the more niche you get into everything with the DSO’s, everybody kind of knows each other. And so if you maybe reach outside a little bit and not to get crazy and pull from a totally different market or different segment, but if you bring a different set of contacts and eyes on it, you maybe get a little bit of a headstart on some groups or some things that are open. So I think that it’s just definitely kind of a next step and a way to integrate those types of folks into this side of the industry.

Bill Neumann:

What about on the revenue cycle management side of things? Where are you finding that talent?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, so I think a lot of it’s been with kind of the movement of everything. So if folks are getting acquired or integrated into larger groups, obviously those folks, their roles may be get eliminated. And so we’ve had a lot of luck with, I call it luck, obviously, it’s not a good spot for the candidate, but experience-wise where they’ve kind of gone through it and come up with a group and understand it. So they have the direct line into exactly what the job description would be.

Jon Fidler:

They know kind of the growth rate, they know how to adapt their performance to where they need to be. But I feel like that’s really where a lot of our candidates have come from. And then I think on the other side too, we typically start getting emails, if there is a deal to be had, or if things are not looking great at a certain group, we’ll get some emails a couple of months ahead of time.

Jon Fidler:

Typically, the candidates, the folks working there currently at those groups know something’s happening. And so they’ll reach out to us and, and just kind of let us know that they may be looking or they’re open to hearing about new opportunities as well. So there’s been a little bit of that, I guess, maybe some unrest with some of the groups and those types of things.

Jon Fidler:

But overall, it’s just kind of a mixture of both sides of maybe being acquired or with groups that maybe are unsettled a little bit, but it’s been interesting to see how things have shaken out here for sure.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. So rev cycle management definitely is more specialized and you’re saying the best candidates tend to be experienced already in a group practice setting or a DSO. Do you find anybody that would come in from outside the industry that would fit right in or typically not?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, no, it typically … and again, it kind of depends on the way the group is working. If things are running pretty smoothly and they’re expanding and they just need to maybe bring somebody in and integrate them, they have kind of a larger team to support them and can kind of ease their way in? That happens very frequently. And we can pull from other healthcare segments that are pretty similar and they just need to have a little bit of a learning curve.

Jon Fidler:

But typically, if things are not running well, it’s a smaller group and there’s not much support around them. Then we would really encourage kind of bringing somebody in that has that direct experience to really kind of limit the mistakes or things that they may miss or things that need tightened up. We would recommend probably bringing somebody in that’s kind of been through the trenches before.

Bill Neumann:

What about any other positions you see that seem to be trending?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. So for us, operations is always kind of the majority of our searches. So whether it’s … there’s obviously a lot more regional and director level roles out there just from the sheer size of groups and opportunities that are out there. But operationally, seems to be a lot of movement and those all kind of come … we look at each individual. Not just group, but, but role individually.

Jon Fidler:

And then kind of the same with the candidates just because, they come from somewhere that has been large, a larger group, and maybe things are running well and they kind of have a playbook for how to do things. We try to narrow it down into each individual candidate and opportunity to make sure there’s a match there. Because again, there’s no single recipe for success for this.

Jon Fidler:

And so, all the DSO’s are kind of structured a little bit differently. The roles and responsibilities are differently. And just because folks have similar titles does not mean they’re doing the same thing every day. You know, it may differ from group a to group B.

Jon Fidler:

And so we really try to not put anybody in just kind of this general setting. We’ll take each role and kind of understand what the needs are for that group and then match it up with the candidates individually, no matter where they come from. You can have two folks from the same group, or the same experience that are applying, but just completely different mindsets and approaches the thing. So we try to do that individually.

Jon Fidler:

And I think that’s something that gets lost in the shuffle sometimes where people just say, “Hey, we don’t want anybody from a large group because they have ABCD reputation.” And it’s like, “Well, let’s talk to the candidates individually. It may match up. They may be looking for or have the skill set that’s what you need.” So we try to break those down individually.

Bill Neumann:

Have you been successful at recruiting operations talent from outside the dental industry?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, very, I think, because there are so many healthcare segments that are structured similarly, with MSO’s and dermatology groups or surgery centers, there’s just a bunch of different … vet, chiropractic is one too. So there’s just a lot of different groups or segments of the healthcare industry that are structured similarly.

Jon Fidler:

We always caution, there’s definitely going to be a little bit of a ramp up period with kind of learning the day-to-day and the different flows and insurance and just kind of getting acclimated that way. But again, we think if they’re a leader, then they can kind of adapt and step in anywhere and be successful.

Bill Neumann:

That’s great. And you know, I’ve got this question here. It comes up a lot, especially with emerging groups. So, the ones that are doctor-owned and led and you’ve got 1, 2, 3, 4 practices. And I think there’s a question, “What positions do I … what nonclinical positions do I look to add first?”

Jon Fidler:

Yep.

Bill Neumann:

And are there any inflection points? Do I do it by number of locations, by revenue? Are there any key milestones that somebody should be looking for?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. And you know, we’re not consultants by any means. We don’t dig into the practices and get into the numbers and EBITDA and PNL’s. And so, typically what we would say is the doctor typically has a feel of where they’re currently at, where the gaps are at, or issues might be personnel-wise or performance-wise.

Jon Fidler:

And so if the doctor kind of knows, “Hey, I don’t like doing the operational side. I want to be in the clinic or I want to be out looking for office number 6, 7, 8, and not really deal with the day to day operational side.” Then of course operations is typically kind of the first one.

Jon Fidler:

I don’t know if we really set black and white. I do know, I’ve heard numbers and once you get to seven or eight or a certain amount of production, once you get to eight or 10 million production and it’s a lot for one person to handle.

Jon Fidler:

And I’d agree with that for the most part. However, I will tell you, there are doctors that are just really good operationally and they may need a marketing person first, or they may need a controller or they may need somebody along the financial lines that they just don’t enjoy doing.

Jon Fidler:

So we try to sit down and kind of break down a little bit and just listen to their story of kind of currently where they’re at, what they enjoy doing, what their passion is or what they’re drawn to. And then bring somebody in to balance that out. And so a lot of times there’ll be working with a consulting group or somebody from the outside, they can kind of give us a little bit better layout of what’s needed. But typically the doctors kind of know, and it’s a little bit different for everybody, but in general, in theory, operationally is kind of the first one that ends up happening.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah. That makes sense. So a lot of good advice from the group side of things, let’s talk about job seekers. So if I’m a nonclinical job seeker looking for an opportunity in the DSO space, tell me a little bit, I mean, is it like it is in other parts of, in any other industry? Are there a lot of opportunities available?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. So I think it’s kind of like what’s happening now. There’s a shortage for certain things and there’s definitely opportunities. I think, from a job seekers standpoint, we always have those initial calls and most of the time, we call them passive candidates because they’re currently employed and they’re just kind of looking for something maybe they don’t currently have.

Jon Fidler:

And so, whether it’s the people they work with or the culture they’re in or the opportunity to move up, title-wise or responsibility-wise. Ultimately, salary and money always comes into play. So we just try to dive into some of those factors because we don’t want somebody that’s just making a rash decision and running from something. We want somebody that kind of has a plan and is looking for some things that give them an opportunity to grow in whichever area of those that they prefer.

Jon Fidler:

But it’s definitely kind of a job seekers market. There are opportunities out there. I think it’s just really how much of, we call it a matrix. That’s where there’s all these moving ancillary parts of, are they able to relocate? Are there certain groups that they prefer to work for? How specific they are in titles that they want to get to and how many offices they want to oversee?

Jon Fidler:

So we try to break all of that down, but there’s definitely, if you can flex a little bit, a lot of opportunities and it just kind of depends on each candidate and what they’re looking for.

Bill Neumann:

Have you noticed an increase in salaries because of the supply demand issue?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, yeah.

Bill Neumann:

What are you seeing?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, in fact, at the Dykema meeting, I was talking to a gentleman that kind of heads one up and he was just kind of asking, “Hey, in general, what does this position pay?” There’s obviously a lot of flexibility and the industry is still very fragmented on pay and titles and those types of things, so there’s wide ranges.

Jon Fidler:

But, I was just kind of telling them some placements that we’d done and where they were at and he just, I think I put him on point a little bit saying, “Maybe somebody’s going to come in and offer more than what he’s offering.” So he’s kind of tightening that up a little bit from his end and trying to figure out some ways to protect those folks.

Jon Fidler:

But yeah, it’s definitely increased for good talent and we try to make sure we’re fair. Obviously, when we get hired, we’re working for the group. So that’s who we work for and we make no bones about that to the candidates. But at the same time, it has to be a two-sided deal.

Jon Fidler:

You know, the candidate has to go in happy with what they’re looking for, but it has to work for the group financially and opportunity-wise as well. So, again, things are fragmented, which can be a blessing and a curse, but there’s definitely opportunities out there for everybody.

Bill Neumann:

Any advice for job seekers when it comes to their resumes, their CV? Have you seen any trends there or what do they need to have and prepare for that?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, I think when we talk to job seekers, we kind of tell them, number one, the resume is simply a piece of paper. It’s like a job description from the hiring side is that. This is going to be the base of everything. When you get into something, you’re going to do 3 million other things that aren’t on that piece of paper. So to kind of have a wide understanding that there’s going to be a lot more to this person than just what’s on the paper.

Jon Fidler:

We do encourage them to kind of put together a resume that kind of tells a story, that obviously has kind of the facts and what they did and responsibilities, but also why did you move? What caused you to … you see all these folks that are jumping around and it’s okay to jump around every few years now. That’s just kind of the way things have evolved within the job market with candidates. If you’re jumping for a better opportunity or more pay or more titles? I don’t think anybody would ever fault folks for that.

Jon Fidler:

What we want to make sure is it doesn’t just look like people are jumping from job to job and running. They started a fire and then they took off. And so we kind of caution them with that and advise that, and then we also have job seekers that are open. I think they don’t really look down and look back at their career and kind of see all the things that they’ve done and how that can relate to certain jobs.

Jon Fidler:

So, we want to make sure that they’re looking at the jobs and the job descriptions and opportunity, and maybe tweaking a few things that not just have one standard resume that works for an operational job. Maybe they want to get into … they’ve done some training in the past and there’s a training opportunity out there, but how do you wrap around that experience and operations to factor into the training side?

Jon Fidler:

And so we kind of just leave it open a little bit, to tell them to, “Let’s look at the role and then look back through your history and experience. And then we’ll kind of cater it to that a little bit, if that’s fair.”

Bill Neumann:

You running into any non-competes? Is that something you see that’s common practice?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That’s always on there. You know, it’s hard from a recruiter standpoint because each state is different. Each candidate has a different risk tolerance for that. Each group has a different risk tolerance. So, typically what we would do is just kind of connect the candidate with the group, kind of let them hammer it out.

Jon Fidler:

And some folks have resources that they can use to kind of challenge those things. Some people just say, “Hey, they’re not enforceable and we’re going.” And so we try to connect them directly with the group and hiring group to figure out exactly what the right approach there and how much time and effort and risk they want to put into it.

Jon Fidler:

But yeah, there’s definitely some non-competes out there, especially the higher up within the organization and titles and experience you get that those are in there that have to be at least dealt with or thought about and talked out.

Bill Neumann:

Let’s talk a little bit about timing from both perspectives, the hiring and the job seeker. I mean, if I’m looking to hire somebody in operations, COO, what can I expect working with you, your organization? How long would it take me to potentially fill that position?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. So, you know, again, I hate to be gray on all these things, there’s a lot of different factors that go into it. We typically say, for a larger group, a COO, it can range anywhere. You know, the minimum we would recommend, obviously you can run into unicorns and we have a fairly standard bullpen of candidates that we know and trust and kind of know what speed they’re at or where they’re at currently in their search process.

Jon Fidler:

And things may happen a little bit quicker, but I would say, you know, the standard would be the 90 to 180 days. Just depends on interviews and schedules and the speed of the group of what they want to move that. Or if they have anything upcoming that they need to kind of time things out. And then, as far as candidates, a lot of times we’ll get folks that are expecting bonuses or have certain projects that they want to make sure they wrap up, because they care for the current role that they’re in and the group they’re with and they want to finish things up properly.

Jon Fidler:

And so just, there’s a lot of movement within that and we try to coordinate all of that. And I would typically say that 90 to 180 is fair. There’ll be plenty of candidates to kind of come through and you’ll have a good foundation of folks to kind of bounce off and compare and then get going from there. But just kind of depends on a lot of that backend side as well.

Bill Neumann:

So I don’t, I don’t know if I missed anything here that you wanted to mention, but before I finish up with a couple of closing questions and statements, is there anything out there that you want to make sure that the GDN audience knows about, again, whether it’s on the job seeker side of things or whether it’s on the group side?

Jon Fidler:

I think just from our standpoint, if we can help out in any way, it’s obviously the executive search side is what pays the bills and we feel like we’re proud of what we do. But if we can ever just have out with questions or if candidates are maybe in a spot where they’re going to start looking in the future, we always just kind of recommend reaching out and we can kind of, and I think from the group side too, if they know things are coming down the pipeline?

Jon Fidler:

Maybe not immediately, where they need to search right now, or they’re not looking for a job right now, but maybe in the next few months, to kind of let us know. We’ll have candidates reach out and kind of put them on the list to be in the bullpen, if something comes open. We’ll have a group say, “Hey, in a couple of months, this is coming open.”

Jon Fidler:

If we can match up folks initially and be transparent of timeframes and all of that, it just really helps things out. And it doesn’t put a lot of stress on it. I think the more stress and time restraints you put on things, people get into kind of hurrying or making bad decisions or rash decisions.

Jon Fidler:

And so, I think the more you can kind of plan things out from both sides on the candidate and group side, and we can help out and facilitate that, we’re more than happy to do that, or just answer questions in general, even if they decide not to work with us or use our services, from either side, we’re happy to help and just try to help make good connections with folks.

Bill Neumann:

Yeah. And I’ll attest to that. I mean, I’ve known Jon for a good number of years now, and I know he’s helped out, met several groups, large and small that I know, just helped them out. Had conversations with them, gave them advice. Some turned into a long time customers of yours, Jon, others haven’t. It’s the way it works.

Bill Neumann:

And then the same thing on the job seeker side of things. I mean, you certainly give back quite a bit to the industry and I’ve seen it firsthand, so I certainly appreciate it. And I know individuals will, and hopefully they’ll work with you. So how do they get in touch with you or one of your associates, Jon, if they want to engage you?

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. No problem. So I think probably the easiest way we obviously have a website folks can go to. It’s a Fidlerandassociates all spelled out. F-I-D-L-E-R-A-N-D associates.com. We have a contact us button they can do. If they want to email me, my email is jfidler@fidlerandassociates.com or feel free to call or text (512) 550-8604 anytime. And we’re happy to help out in any way.

Bill Neumann:

That’s great. Yeah. And we’ll make sure that we post the email address and the website in the show notes. Jon’s just a solid guy, been in the industry for a long time, just like I have. Comes from the other side of the tracks. He came from the distribution side. I came from the manufacturer side.

Bill Neumann:

But yeah, it just goes to show that he can really find a lot of talent, whether it’s inside the industry already, or whether it’s coming from the outside. A lot of movement in the industry right now. It’s dynamic with all the consolidation going on. There’s going to be more and more opportunities on the operation side. Talked about the business development side, revenue cycle management. Just really kind of a great time to be, I think, in the DSO space. Exciting and quite a bit of fun.

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. We’re all very fortunate to be in this industry. And I always joke that once you kind of get into dental, not too many people leave and go somewhere else. So that tells you how good the people are and the opportunity in the industry. So we’re very fortunate.

Bill Neumann:

I was told that back in 2003 when I started, and I didn’t know if that would be a good thing or a bad thing, but it’s a great thing.

Jon Fidler:

Growing up, I always just thought I’d be in executive search in the dental industry, man. That’s what I always wanted to grow up being, yeah. Never know where the road’s going to lead, but here we are. And couldn’t be happier.

Bill Neumann:

There you go. Well, thank you, Jon. Again, Jon Fidler, Fidler and associates. He is the CEO, founder, president of, I think one of the few, if not only executive search firms dedicated to the DSO space and certainly the best known. And so I appreciate you being here today and educating the Group Dentistry Now audience on all things executive search in the industry.

Jon Fidler:

Yeah. I appreciate you having us on and back at you, man. I just appreciate all you do for the industry and fortunate to know you and be a part of it. So appreciate the opportunity.

Bill Neumann:

And until next time I’m Bill Neumann, and this is the group dentistry now show. We’ll see y’all later.